Ars Magica Welcome
From: David Chart Posted on: 6/19/2002 5:37 pm
To: ALL
Message: 21.1
Welcome to the new Ars Magica forum.

Post stuff.

David Chart
Ars Magica Line Editor
From: AlexAtAtlas Posted on: 6/19/2002 5:44 pm
To: David Chart
Message: 21.2
in reply to: 21.1
Eloquent and informational.

(Just so you know, David, I just turned on all your forum powers. You're a forum god to all, bowing to none but me.)

Alex Knapik
Atlas Games

From: ditchhook Posted on: 6/27/2002 3:06 pm
To: David Chart
Message: 21.3
in reply to: 21.1
Apprentices

Game rules require that magi have at least a score of five in every art before taking on an apprentice. As numbers like this should not be expressed or understood in-character, this rule must be imposed out-of-character.

Q1: What rules have storyguides introduced to guide Mercere mages who wish to adopt ungifted apprentices. Should a gifted redcap be blocked from adopting an ungifted apprentice altogether? Should she be required to wait until she has five or more in every magical art to adopt an ungifted apprentice?

Q2: Have folks been tempted to scheme around (or ignore) the restrictions (of five in every art)? What approaches have they adopted in doing so? I have heard suggested that a "potential" apprentice be trained in some mundane arts (Latin, Order Lore, etc.) while a player continued to improve his character to the required standards. I see no problem with such an approach. Does anyone else?

Q3: What might the game creators have had in mind when they introduced this restriction? How might ignoring this rule effect game play in a way I might not have foreseen?

From: dromedan Posted on: 6/27/2002 6:08 pm
To: ditchhook
Message: 21.4
in reply to: 21.3
Re: Q2. We had a new player join our covenant as a non-magus with the potential to become a mage, and the way we handled it was we swapped off teaching her (she was sort of a joint apprentice), as the 4 of us who were magi had a 5 in every art between us.

Of course, this was an Ars Magica Moderna game, and she worked for the FBI, so your mileage may vary....

From: Damelon Kimbrough Posted on: 7/12/2002 11:05 am
To: ditchhook
Message: 21.5
in reply to: 21.3
Re: Q1 - I would imagine all sorts of rules have been introduced to address gifted Mercere training ungifted Redcaps, I also imagine it being a non-issue for many storytellers. I, for instance, would not impose any sort of minimum Art score restrictions on a gifted Mercere training an ungifted Redcap, but I suspect that most players would not bother. The time you are training your mundane Redcap, is time you are not building your scores for more productive uses like training a gifted apprentice or producing your first longevity potion.

Re: Q2 - I suspect minimum Art scores for training apprentices were included to dissuade players from seeking their own apprentices straight out of their own completed apprenticeships. By imposing that guideline you force even the most well rounded new magus to spend at least a few years developing his Arts. There is not currently any functional difference between a master with fives in all their scores or tens from a rules standpoint in training an apprentice (at least that I can remember). Players (from a rules standpoint) are free to completely ignore the specialties and weaknesses of the magus who trained their character and create a character that by all rights could never be trained by the master in question. Perhaps when a fifth edition is done, this is a topic that might be addressed.

Re: Q3 - The game mechanics, as they stand, do not address what happens if you ignore the rule of five, so there is no (official) unforseen consequence.

As the SG you are, of course, free to create guidelines to address this subject.

Damelon Kimbrough
The once and future grog...