i wonder if this has bothered anyone... sure... maybe they shouldnt add anything to stats or bonuses to AV's... but have of any you came up with a way that makes players want to use these, but not over use them?

i was thinking about giving the player an intimidate roll or something

I had a Masked Avenger character who used a big handgun with a laser scope because it was cool/intimidating. :)

i dont think there shoud be any AV bonuses either... as i said... (or if i mistyped, i am saying it now)

but, theres no reason to have them, or not to have them.... i was just gonna do something like a +1 to an intimidation check... since it says they are intimidating... but yet gives no rules for it, thus making it nothing.

the biggest thing though... other than for giggles... there is no reason to use them or not..

even though by the book, it says they are intimidating...

i wont give a player an auto intimidate thing... thats too silly..

Or maybe a schtick for when The Dot appears on someone's back...

might be good, im just trying to think of something for it, so that it does matter SOME that people use it, but not much if they dont... kind of like real life.

allowing it to increase aim to +4 sounds good to me

Laser Pointer increases the AV to shoot with the enhanced weapon by 1.

SYL

And "too good"? Martial Artists can increase their AVs by huge numbers, so a small +1 (perhaps limited to hitting a target, not dodging it) is not really "too good".

SYL

Well, yeah. This is Feng, after all. ;P

Martial artists can increase their AV by about 3, relibably. Plus they can only do it a limited number of times a sequence. A permanent +1 AV bonus for no cost should really be avoided. It's equivalent to 16 XP for a starting Killer. It won't help you with dodges, granted, but I want my players to work for their bonuses.

Compared to the other side of fighting in FS, the Kung-Fu-Fighting: arenīt they underpowered? ;-)

SYL

And I'm not so sure guns are really all that underpowered. There's no way to run out of Chi/Fu. There isn't the variety of Fu schticks, but having a more limited set of gun schticks may make them more effective. And there are some definite advantages to gun schticks that the other schticks don't have easy access to. For example:

* Fastdraw - instantly increases your SPD, which is an ability that just isn't available in any of the other abilities

* Aiming - schticks that increase your AV are few and far between, but anyone with a gun can do this for free. Incredibly useful for taking down high-AV villians, while the martial artists have to hope for a lucky roll.

Currently I donīt see the +1 for Laserpointers as "bad".

SYL

On the one hand, I gave the laser-pointer the +1 AV bonus in Iron & Silk because, as an improvised weapon (attachment), it has the opportunity of being rendered irrelevant by GM fiat, by smoke and haze, and by a fumble.

On the other hand, part of the point of a laser sight is that it helps you aim *quickly*, especially in the case of pistols with laser sights. So, increasing the aim maximum doesn't really seem to fit the bill. I thought, "maybe it cuts straight to a +2 bonus when aiming," and went with that for a while, but found that less palatable over time.

The simplest way to present it was as a simple bonus which could be enjoyed by any character without Gun schticks and such. Likewise I was trying to make the effect of the laser sight meaningful enough that characters on the receiving end of one would actually be alarmed.

In the end, I came up with, I think, five ways to handle them. For the purposes of Iron & Silk, I kept it as simple as possible. As it says in Iron & Silk, though, context is everything. What works in your game *right now* overrides whatever baseline I can give you. Beyond that, I'm planning on returning to the other laser sight options in a future book, should the opportunity present itself.

Lot of great ideas in this thread, too. I recommend you try them all.

word,
Will Hindmarch
Feng Shui Line Developer
Atlas Games

definately alot of ideas... one is in the concept behind the laser sight thing..

in a way, i can see the laser as a crutch for someone who doesnt aim very well in the first place...

so perhaps making the laser sight give a +2 to aiming (replacing any other bonuses that comes from aiming)... the change the aim thing, over to an actual schtick... like dead aim or something, and add in nice bonuses to that..

now what about the people who dont have the schtick, and dont have the laser sight?.... i guess just use a standard +1... sure, some snipers might get upset, after having aimed at this one guy for a while... but they should have the deam aim schtick... heh

possible ways for the dead aim to function in game mechanics:

spend X number of shots aiming, then you gain that much to your AV... that brings its own problems of course, but you dont sit there in the middle of combat and aim down with the named character thats standing 5 feet away from you..

what do you guys think?...

SYL

SYL

that just seems too silly though..lol

other have agreed that a flat bonus can be fine... but can be obnoxious... seeing as people are likely to use laser sights for alot then...