Ars Magica Using muto to deadly effect
From: marklawford Posted on: 9/30/2004 10:07 am
To: ALL
Message: 408.1
I've been asked to consider whether a muto corpus spell could be used to change a target's face to seal that target's mouth and nose, thereby suffocating the poor afflicted soul.

That would be a fairly easy little kill so I am a little wary of the suggestion.

In essence, the spell is simple enough, but the intended effects seem to me to somewhat outweigh the spell itself. Having said that I'm leaning towards giving the magus the benefit of the doubt but don't want to set up any dangerous precendents.

Do you guys have any suggestions as to how I should approach the spell?

Mark

From: spuwdsda2 Posted on: 9/30/2004 3:03 pm
To: marklawford
Message: 408.2
in reply to: 408.1

Afaik there are two main schools of thought over this issue.

Many SGs say *any* 'kill' effects should be at least about Lv35 at R:Near. Instant kill should be about Lv40 at R:Near.

Others say that the level of a spell should follow strictly from the guidelines.

Assuming you want to persue the second approach, all is not lost. You can invoke the 'unnatural' argument to increase the level of the effect. Muto is usually used to make changes that in some way accord with nature. Changing the size or appearance of a man is fairly easy, Changing a man into a women is harder. Changing a man into an animal is hard still. Giving a man wings is harder that that (iirc).

Making a change that is completely outside nature can be judged the most difficult type of Muto effects. Therefore you might still argue that the spell is high level without seeming arbitory.

Regards

- D Woods

From: marklawford Posted on: 9/30/2004 6:53 pm
To: spuwdsda2
Message: 408.3
in reply to: 408.2
Thanks for the reply. I certainly don't want to be arbitrary, and I think that labelling the spell "Perdo" because it has a kill effect is verging on that territory.

I think I will invoke the "unnatural effect" option to raise the difficulty. I am sure the magus in question will make the spell but at least I can feel justified in raising the bar a little.

Thanks again.

Mark

From: Ed9C Posted on: 9/30/2004 7:06 pm
To: marklawford
Message: 408.4
in reply to: 408.1
It is also not all that easy a kill, because most people of that time at least carried a belt knife, and would most likely deem the pain of cutting a new mouth a reasonable tradeoff fgr survival...

Ed C

From: spuwdsda2 Posted on: 10/1/2004 3:05 am
To: Ed9C
Message: 408.5
in reply to: 408.4

Possible, but imo many people wouldn't understand what had happened for a while. Imo most would panic and then fall unconscious. Their companions might help this way though (a tracheotomy would be a skilled option). It's not an instant kill by any means.

Regards

- David W

From: marklawford Posted on: 10/1/2004 4:33 am
To: Ed9C
Message: 408.6
in reply to: 408.4
One of the hardest parts of roleplaying is trying to react to magic as though it was something frightening and unexpected. I think any strange, unexpected, unnatural and frightening event would be met with panic.

If it was targetted against a grog who is used to magic then there may be a more measured response. Without that I think the poor victim will very quickly suffocate and if not released from the spell will die as a consequence. Not an instant kill, but fairly well assured.

Mark

From: spuwdsda2 Posted on: 10/1/2004 11:59 am
To: marklawford
Message: 408.7
in reply to: 408.6

Another level factor is that the spell needs to be D:Sun to reliably kill (barring aid). D:Dia would often just render the victim (if healthy) unconscious.

Regards

- D Woods

From: Ed9C Posted on: 10/8/2004 2:28 pm
To: spuwdsda2
Message: 408.8
in reply to: 408.7
You could use a dur:Conc for a more flexible spell... But that might require some game mechanics...

Ed

From: spuwdsda2 Posted on: 10/8/2004 5:18 pm
To: Ed9C
Message: 408.9
in reply to: 408.8

I was imagining a combat situation. A D:Conc spell ties you up. The D:Dia version would take the subject out (sort of) and you are free to cast other spells et al, without fear of losing Conc.

But if you are imagining an intimidation/torture scenerio, D:Conc would be perfect.

Regards

- David W