a magus can take faerie magic (free as a merinita) and the enigma with the use of a flaw?

I don't understand if this type of merits are only for the members of the appropriate house of are open to all (with the associate flaw...).
This is because the two merit in questions are both "cult", so evry member of that cult can ipotetically take this no?

Any help will be precious thanks!

Bye.

To take Faerie Magic, you must belong to House Merinita. To take Verditius Magic, you must belong to House Verditius. To take The Enigma, you must belong to House Criamon. That is the intent of the Mystery Cults and their Virtues.

Also, *every* member of the mystery House gets their special Virtue for free. It is not optional; it's part of being a member of the House.

I think the idea is that IF you can get someone to teach you the mystery, there is some flaw associated with it. For all except Faerie Magic, the flaw is clear- 1) Heartbeast means no famaliar, 2) Enigma- points make it more likely to undergo twilight, 3) Verditius- need casting tools for formulaic spells (and much reduced benefit 5th ed IMHO). Faerie magic only requires you obtain, or have obtained, 1 pt of Faerie warp if you don't have a faerie flaw OR virtue. So if you have a Faerie virtue, there's no real down side to the OUTER mystery.

As far as having to be a member of the house, I didn't get the impression that was a hard and fast rule. IF a member of a true lineage, say Bonisagus, wanted to learn (subject himself to) the enigma, Criamon magi would probably take the issue on a case by case basis. I'd doubt they'd require that person to leave Bonisagus.

I'd just like to add here, that while I'm not happy with all the changes to these forms of magic, I am intrigued by the fact that they are being treated as mysteries, and OUTER mysteries at that, I look forward to seeing them further developed, but please don't push out any of the established mysteries to do it. :)

Yes, I too was intrigued by the use of the phrase outer mystery. I am not sure if it is a tantalising advert for future developments and supplements, or perhaps we are just viewing the phrase from the wrong end...

To clarify, outer mysteries may simply refer to those further from the core structure; much the same as 'outer planets' or 'outer gods'. They may simply be the most odd elements, and the inner mysteries are simply the secrets of the hermetic magical tradition.

Just a thought.

I believe that listing the mysteries as virtues allows the creation of maga that have belonged to a particular house in the past and now, for some reason, belong to another.

It seems to be a fanciful thought that a maga, once a member of a house, never gets pissed and leaves. I am not denying that such a leaving wouldn't have issues associated with it, maybe even a declaration of a wizard's war against the leaver. But it has to have happened, and will continue to happen. That is why I believe that these mysteries are refered to as 'outer' mysteries.

Certainly, like most secret societies, the initiates to an order are only taught the minor secrets. As time passes and the initiate (apprentice) becomes a full member (magus), he is taught some of the secrets, but not given the keys to the vault. Only after long years of service to the Order and to the House will the inner and innermost mysteries be taught, and probably under geas or pain of death, etc.

It certainly adds a new dimension to a saga where a maga has to choose between his sodalis and house. Whether to study the magic for the next few years, or undertake a dangerous and lengthy quest to prove his deserving worth to his house leadership. Maybe even to try to "borrow" the knowledge of an outer mystery from one of the houses.

Seems like a number of new challenges for my troupe instead of the old, "where's the dragon."

pg. 11:
"the twelve house fall into three groups [...].Four are Mystery cults, and magi can join those houses by being initiated into the cult. Such initiations theach the outher mystery of the cult [...].
It is relatively easy to join these house after training, and magi who feel that they do not fit in to their old houses often do it."

So i can take enigma from my hold house and than change to house merinita and than take faery magic, with a flaw to compensate that as per pg 92:
"[...] the character takes o a general flaw, usually minor, and in return gets one or more virtues [...]"

> "It is relatively easy to join these house after training, and magi
> who feel that they do not fit in to their old houses often do it."

This sentence comes after explaining about the last of the three groups,
the Societas, gatherings of magi with common interests. It does not
apply to either True Lineages or Mystery Cults.

> "So i can take enigma from my hold house and than change to house
> merinita and than take faery magic..."

I understood that you can only join the Societas freely, when you have
passed their requirements (there were some in Houses of Hermes).
You can always make a new house rule in your campaign, allowing this,
of course.

//B