There must be a good reason for this.
(5th edition fixed a lot of 4th edition bugs but this seems like 5th edition bug.)

level 30, muto corpus
-turn a human into an insubstantial object (auram requisite)

level 35, creo corpus
-increase on of person's physical characteristics by one point, to no more than +1.

Wow! It's easier to turn into stinking cloud than to have a str of 1.

Idea was that with ritual it would not be too easy boost your stats, but still, it should be possible to boost your stats a little and difficult to boost them permanently.

Should not Rego Corpus be able to boost your stats to your natural maximum? rego = do what normally is possible. (hey, what about teleport??)

uh, I am confused.

I think you are missing that these are the base minimum Guidelines: Personal, Momentary, Individual.
As it happens, the Creo GL are expected to work with the Ritual rules, as a Momentary Creo Ritual can be natural and endure beyond the end of the spell. It is a general feature throughout ArM5 that certain effects have a lower spell level as a Momentary Ritual than the spell level of a non-ritual extended duration version: temporary healing of wounds without Vis has a higher level than permanently healing the same wound with a Mom Ritual.
It is indeed a higher spell-level to boost your stats with a non-Ritual Moon duration, than it is with a Mom. Ritual...
Yes, it is deliberate... it makes sense in certain views, and may not in others. One explanation is that Rituals, even if lower level, are innately "harder" but more powerful than temporary spells.

The Muto spell effect will always vanish when the spell duration ends... so even Sun duration is pushed past the level of the +1 stat bonus...
You can't usefully have a Momentary Muto spell for most effects, as the always-reverts spoils the result. (The few that work are of the variety of "make some mundane change during the brief moment of spell effect" - eg turn metal to gas, and pull the door open while the lock is gaseous.)

No I have not.

It's higher level spell to boost your stat by one for one day than permanently.

It's usually very logical but in this case I disagree.

Perhaps I have gotten used to Mage the Ascension where temporary stat boosting was not that hard, but permanent boosting caused warping so no body wanted that.

> It's higher level spell to boost your stat by one for one day than
> permanently.
> It's usually very logical but in this case I disagree.

you started by pointing out it was harder to increase Sta to +1 than to change into a cloud; that's not true by my argument as the Cloud spell needs extended duration, while the Mom ritual doesn't. (And no Mom Ritual exists for the Cloud spell 'cos it's Muto).

On your second point of disagreeing with the "for a day" being harder than "made real" (not permanent spell - that could be dispelled; but permanent result yes)... I can see your point, but it's nothing to do with the Stat increase, but is generic to the use of guidelines for spells, increasing level for duration, and allowing Momentary Creo Rituals a special status.

If you really don't like it, then pick some minimum duration or level increase, and say that the Creo Mom Ritual "trick" requires that instead of the base Mom level.

Having used to system for some while now, I am myself quite happy with this distinction, accepting that the extra stress of casting ritual magic, and the high expense of Vis used, makes the trade-off acceptable. Level is not the only factor in spell design...

Can you suggest a fix that would be within 5th rules?

I mean, is there any guideline on how to increase stats with rego or muto.

If Muto would increase stats, by very nature it would be temporary change.

If Muto can Increase character's size, then increasing his muscles should be within parameters also. Target: partial, base spell prenatural growth. That would make it lvl 15 spell, duration of sun.

If you changed soak into charactersistic, levels seemed better.

Still the problem is that Creo is meant for characteristic increase.

But Muto Corpus stat increase by base rules is legal because you can turn into Bear, and bear is stronger than human.

Without Animal prequisite, you could turn into Little John, who is bigger than you, and stronger than you and get his physical appearance, size and characteristics.

Shape of the woodland needs wolfskin so that you can change. Is that sort of arcane connection to the wolf, you need it's dna to get it's form and abilities. I suppose book does say or should say that muto corpus spells need that focus or they fail.

So level 25 spell is "Turn into another man" and you need that man's hair or nail or you cannot change. It's easier than boosting your pattern with higher stats as you borrow somebody elses pattern, you have to live with his features also.

Thank you, I solved the question within base rules, in a way that works better within game philosophy.

(was text above confusing, not to me anyway.)
:)

It's hard to suggest a "fix" if I don't see a problem 8-)
I personally subscribe to the "5e is better, and I do it that way"... I grew to love ArM with 4e, but am a full convert to 5e...

In 5e, the roles of the 5 Techniques are clearly stated: Creo is to create, and of perfection (and is "natural");
Muto is for Unnatural changes - properties which objects cannot naturally have;
Rego is for Natural Changes - properties and actions which objects naturally do, like "move" or "bend".

Size change is not something objects naturally do, so it is Muto.
Increasing Stats is a perfection, up to the maximum natural for a man (+5) and so is Creo; as Creo it can be fixed by a Mom. Ritual.
Increasing Stats above +5 is not natural, so requires a Muto req. and can't be fixed by a Creo Ritual.
Changing Stats is not a "thing which people naturally do" so you can't do it with Rego.

In the case of muscles, you can indeed consider "bulging muscles" as unnatural growth in Muto; you may be able to come up with similar explanations for the other 5 characteristics, for other Muto spells. The trick here is that you are "growing muscles" rather than "increasing stats".

Wolfskin is not needed to change into a Wolf - you can invent spells without such a casting tool... but if you do, the spell runs to the end of its duration. Curse of Circe is just such a spell!
The skin *is* needed for SotWP, but so that you can *end* the spell at will rather than how you begin it. It's pre-Hermetic magic, similar to the "Skinchanger" Virtue... (There is no "dna" in Mythic Europe...) It's also why such spells phrase the casting tool as a "cape" not just as "a scrap of..." - it's so you can (a) symbolically "put it on" when the spell is cast, so you can (b) symbolically "take it off" (even though it's not with the target) and end the spell.

In the case of "become a different person" you have 2 choices: (1) spell lasts for standard duration (which may be Conc.) and requires no casting tool. Sponts. are always like that...
(2) spell requires a cape of man-skin, and changes you into a particular man; you can end the spell at will.

Thank you for the clarifications.

Now I do not see a problem anymore, except that I do not have rules for 'building muscles' but I think that later.

That wolfskin explanation was really new to me and now it strikes to me as 'ofcourse!' idea, you do want to end the spell somehow!

I think it is enough if you have wolf's pawn and use that as a symbolic focus, or stolen soldiers hair, arcane connection is hermetic enough explanation. Spell ends when somebody takes away the pawn from wolf's neck.