Ars Magica Ars Otherwhere
From: AngusGM Posted on: Aug-19 12:32 pm
To: ALL
Message: 702.1

I've been playing AM since the 2nd edition. While the setting is good old Mythic Europe, the first saga I ran took place in Harn. Why? Well, because the group I was in was grad students of medieval and renaissance history (along with a stray vulcanologist). As such, to avoid argument on minutiae of history we ran the game in the closest proximity -- Harn maps, medieval culture, with monotheism ported in. It worked rather well.

Since then all of my sagas have been set in Europe, but what with looking at other threads and some thoughts of my own, I have wondered about what rules and parameters one would need to construct to place Ars Magica in another time or place.

For example, after reading "Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrel" (as well as the Patrick O'Brian series), I was suddenly struck with the notion of Regency Magica. So I started reading Byron, Austen, Radcliffe and the like and have started developing some notions in that direction.

What other periods or places are others interested in seeing? Are there any websites currently devoted to such topics? Is Ars Japan the thing, or is it Modern Magica? What of truly High Fantasty or something of that ilk?

Enquiring minds want to know. ;-)

From: ArsBrevis Posted on: Aug-19 9:31 pm
To: AngusGM
Message: 702.2
in reply to: 702.1

For me, it would definitely be the Bronze Age, and centred in Mesopotamia: the technological revolution of the silicate valleys that produced the first professional farmers, soldiers, merchants, scribes, kings, priests, prostitutes, teachers, thieves, physicians and of course magi. The craft of working magic might be the most important of all, making a tribe strong enough to settle and survive and grow instead of having to scuttle from place to place, always running or hiding from some supernatural threat.

The big difference would be in the Realms of Power. The Gods are powerful bringers of both good and ill*; dangerous spirits are to be placated as often as opposed; and the world abounds with cunning and wonderful creatures. I would wrap them all up into one source of wild power. The role of civilisation is to turn chaos to order, making deals with the gods for fertility and protection, repelling savage creatures and peoples, making life safe for humans to flourish. And yet magi, the most powerful bastions of civilisation, needs must draw their power from the magical wilds (though others might protect simple nomads and noble magical creatures from repressive kings, brutal armies and corrupt court wizards).

Most ancient kings acted as priests, but many had a retinue of seers and magicians, so if there's an equivalent to the OoH, it won't prohibit its members from serving their local rulers. But it has to forbid direct aggression against other cities and magi, otherwise its members would be mortal enemies much of the time (and they would quickly destroy the towns they're fighting over). Instead of having to be discreet, magi might have to refrain from violence, at least against other civilised people, which explains why texts describe magic as being used more for healing and divination rather than slaying one's enemies.

In the Bronze Age, the church was very much a part of the state - whether a city-state (in Greece, early Mesopotamia, or the Indus Valley), an empire (later Mesopotamia, especially Assyria) or a nation (Egypt, China). A magus has more in common with his fellow magi than his fellow countrymen, and his power comes from the uncivilised outlands, so relations with the king would be uneasy. Rather like the problems that can arise in modern countries when they need the expertise of groups of scientists who don't share the government's aims.

On a more practical level, there are differences from Medieval times, but none that I can think of are huge. For magi, the biggest problem is that parchment and paper haven't been invented - Egyptians use papyrus, but in Mesopotamia a small library comprises thousands of clay tablets. All metal is rare and expensive, and iron - from meteorites - is the most valuable of all. No-one can ride a horse, but in the later Bronze Age chariots are used (and the horses might run even faster if the charioteer is Gifted). Just about any field of scholarship is more primitive than in the Middle Ages, with superstition filling the gaps.

A rather macabre thought has struck me: the very earliest dynasties in Sumer, Egypt and China all practised human sacrifice, but in all three places it was rapidly abandoned as the culture advanced. Coincidence?

*For example, the Sumerians knew that the gods had once drowned virtually the entire human race; they hadn't yet found out that this was perfectly acceptable.

(Edited for spelling.)



Edited 9/10/2005 1:51 pm ET by ArsBrevis
From: Tuura Posted on: Aug-20 1:55 pm
To: ArsBrevis
Message: 702.3
in reply to: 702.2

This is a cool idea. I like it a lot.

My brother played a campaign that was essentially the origins of the Order of Hermes. The characters were the first magi trained in the Hermetic system. Their teachers either being taught by a Founder or brought into a Founders house. The Aegis of the Hearth has only recently been invented and has not spread across the order. The troupe decieded which spells were the oldest spells in the order and nothing else (in terms of spells) existed/had been invented yet.

Certamin didn't exist yet and the game was very violent. One of the storylines of the game was the characters were sort of "Regulator" bring peace to the make shift Order of Hermes.

I've always wanted to play in old Rome. The Cult of Mercury with a few High Priests that can cast a few powerful spells. Hedge wizards, can't rival the power and range of Mercurian rituals but make up for it in the diversity of minor feats they can accoplish.

The world of "Rome" reeks with dramatic story potential. Beyond this, I never put much thought into it.

I realize it will never happen, but I always thought it would be cool of Atlas came out with a lone book or a series of books that detail alternate settings inside the world of Mythic Europe.

Mythic Japan, Mythic Rome, Mythic Mesopotamia.

These wouldn't be different worlds, but different times and places. No alternate rules, nothing that would cause a rule problem for 'standard' Ars, simply material settings are consistent and complimentary to "Mythic Europe".

Yes I know there's Scandanavia, Iceland, and I suppose Shaman, but I always wanted to play outside the Order of Hermes. An Ars game without Hermetics. Ok, I'm officially rambleing now.

Chuck

From: B5Rebel Posted on: Aug-21 8:46 am
To: ALL
Message: 702.4
in reply to: 702.3
Currently running a saga in Vinland (N. America) 1001 AD, the covenant fled there to avoid the chaos that will soon turn into the war that destroys house Diedne.
From: Dr. Tom Posted on: Aug-22 1:57 pm
To: AngusGM
Message: 702.5
in reply to: 702.1

There is a website for running a Renaissance Ars Magica game:
http://www.canaan.demon.co.uk/roleplaying/venice/venice.html

I've worked with different time periods - several games set arount the (1st) millenium, a brief attempt at Rome. I'm keen on exploring the Renaissance and early post-Renaissance era more, seeing the rise of Natural Magicians through the period.

I have ordered a copy of Northern Crown Adventures to see whether I may wish to convert some of that over to an Ars Magica game during that rough time period.

From: Dr. Tom Posted on: Aug-22 2:00 pm
To: Tuura
Message: 702.6
in reply to: 702.3

//I realize it will never happen, but I always thought it would be cool of Atlas came out with a lone book or a series of books that detail alternate settings inside the world of Mythic Europe.

Mythic Japan, Mythic Rome, Mythic Mesopotamia.

These wouldn't be different worlds, but different times and places. No alternate rules, nothing that would cause a rule problem for 'standard' Ars, simply material settings are consistent and complimentary to "Mythic Europe".//

I agree, it would definitely be nice. Mythic Japan would be good, as would Mythic Cathay. Having been involved in a (3rd ed) campaign set in Cathay I appreciate being able to use alternate settings. Given the opening of trade routes to Cathay through Constantinople, it might not be out of line for some of the books to eventually appear; not anytime soon, of course, but one can hope.

From: EasyPeasy Posted on: Aug-26 1:34 pm
To: AngusGM
Message: 702.7
in reply to: 702.1

>>> For example, after reading "Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrel" (as well as the Patrick O'Brian series), I was suddenly struck with the notion of Regency Magica. So I started reading Byron, Austen, Radcliffe and the like and have started developing some notions in that direction.

I've wanted to do that ever since I read GURPS Goblins: Ars Magica set in #### London.

An industrial revolution fuelled by magic.

From: EasyPeasy Posted on: Aug-26 1:37 pm
To: EasyPeasy
Message: 702.8
in reply to: 702.7
It seems some sort of checker considers D I C K E N S I A N rude!?
From: Ravenscroft Posted on: Aug-27 4:09 am
To: ALL
Message: 702.9
in reply to: 702.7

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0152046151/104-8060635-4378306?v=glance

Sorcery and Cecelia or The Enchanted Chocolate Pot:
Being the Correspondence of Two Young Ladies of Quality Regarding Various Magical Scandals in London and the Country
by Caroline Stevermer, Patricia C. Wrede

The Grand Tour :
Being a Revelation of Matters of High Confidentiality and Greatest Importance, Including Extracts from the Intimate Diary of a Noblewoman and the Sworn Testimony of a Lady of Quality
by Caroline Stevermer, Patricia C. Wrede

For the Regency Fans , i thoroughly recommend the first book.
It should also be available in Softcover.
The sequel "The Grand Tour" i have not as yet read.

From: AngusGM Posted on: Aug-27 11:28 am
To: Ravenscroft
Message: 702.10
in reply to: 702.9

Hmmm, these books sound interesting. I've already read by Patrick O'Brian & Jane Austen, as well as a number of the old Gothic writers (Radcliffe, Lewis, Byron, Goethe, Shelley, Maturin, etc.). And, of course, several histories of the era. I think I shall have to pick at least the first of these Wrede books up, though. Thank you so much for the recommendation!

And then after that we shall see what sort of game actually arises. I must admit I am having fun doing the research. If nothing else, it looks like I am going to have to make social standing and Reputations rather more prominent...

From: StevePettit Posted on: Aug-27 12:50 pm
To: ALL
Message: 702.11
in reply to: 702.10

I've run a short-lived saga in the near future of the Order, in 1250, but that was still in France (Aquitane, near Brioux and Angelome). It was a fun, brief romp.

A project I've been working on and off on is adapting the Ars rules to the setting of Skies of Arcadia (a videogame RPG. but a fascinating one). Progress is slow, as always, but it is kind of fun to see how far the rules and mechanics can be bent and still work. Some of the work, by necessity, has to be original, but it might have application in a normal Ars game as well...

Steve

From: haakonolav Posted on: Aug-31 9:35 pm
To: ALL
Message: 702.12
in reply to: 702.11

Well I had once a plan to make an Ars campaign set during the black plague. It was to be an endtimes campaign where Judgement Day was some time during the late 14th century. The plan was to start an ordinary campaign and let it progress with omens and calamities until the players have to choose on which side they stand.

Also I fail to see why Northern Crown were made d20 and not using Ars rules. The market seems to go against d20 now (or rather 3rd party d20 from the numbers I've seen) so it would have been smart using something else (and it would have been a great Ars Elseworld).
Haakon Olav Thunestvedt