I want to develope a ritual that creates a real object...a sword.

It has to be made of human bones.
It has to be as hard as a normal metal sword, or even harder.
It has to be as sharp as possible.
And it has to be HUGE...UNNATURALLY HUGE (does anyone know the manga "Berzerk" ? ^_^).

The Technique is obviously CREO...but what about the FORM?
Any requisites?
And how much damage should it do?

The spell would be...

Creo + ? + Ritual
Base Level: ?
R: T
D: M
T: I
Unnatural ?
+1 Size ?

Do I dare ask for a Brief review of Beserk? I was thinking of bringing it into my store.

Having said that, your once again making this sword all wrong.

Here's how I would make "The Big Sword of Bone/Metal Death"

I would get a lot of bones. Chicken bones, the bones of that boy you crushed while trying to lift a box, the bones of all the grogs you killed with Deft Hand of the Cruel Wizard.

Use Muto Corpus to turn them into bone soup.

Pour the bone soup into the mold of a sword. Let sit until hard (Cancel the Muto Soup spell)

Now you have your big sword made of bone and it can look strange to because of the mold. Use Deft Hand of the Cruel Wizard to force another little boy to sharpen the sword.

Why? Because it's much more expensive than just asking someone to sharpen it.

In a fashion simular to Edge of the Razor use Muto Corpus to take your very sharp sword and make it unnaturally sharp.

Use a SEPERATE Muto Corpus spell to increase the durablity of the sword (Botches required to break it).

Check me on this one, but use Rego Corpus to lighten the load of the weapon.

These spells will need to be recast every year. The item is magical and can be resisted by Parma Magica.

Damn look at that! No Rituals, no Enchantments, not bad if I do say so. You could probably arm your entire Puppet Army with these bad boys inside a Season.

Enjoy.

Chuck

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0318871/combined

I have seen "Berserk" and think it's great.
This is not a happy story , but it does have some great characterizations.
Iirc , the anime covers the middle part of the first story arc in the manga.
The out-takes are hysterical , well worth watching.
Reading the IMDB message boards at the bottom of the page might give you better views on what people think.

You want something to get in , try "Those Who Hunt Elves" series 01 & 02.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0204088/combined
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0204087/combined
Some of the funniest moments of my anime viewing turned up in these series.
Both titles are well worth watching.

Neither of these is your "big-breasted girls giving gratuitous panty shots".
So if this is what your main anime customers want , these titles are definitely not for them.

I never heard of "Those Who Hunt Elves"...I'll definitely try it ^_^

Berzerk...the manga is 100% better than the anime...and the anime is not bad at all ;)
The story is grim, the mood is dark, the setting is cruel...all characters are really well developed and interesting.

// Now you have your big sword made of bone and it can look strange to because of the mold. Use Deft Hand of the Cruel Wizard to force another little boy to sharpen the sword. //

LOL :P
I deserve this ^_^

Anyway I wanted to make a "real non-magical" item.
I'm quite the "clockwork freak" soo...
As far as I can understand (you are seriously undermining my sense of self confidence! XP ) whatever I dish out with a Creo ritual is permanent and non-magical.
And that is the only way to bring a permanent/non-magical item into existence.

Anyway it will have a lot of requirements :P
Corpus, because it's bone.
Terram, because it has to be more resilient than normal bone.
Muto, again to make bones resistent and more sharp.
etc...

And at the end I don't have the slightest idea about what statistics this "thing" will have ^_^

//I want to develope a ritual that creates a real object...a sword.

It has to be made of human bones.
It has to be as hard as a normal metal sword, or even harder.
It has to be as sharp as possible.
And it has to be HUGE...UNNATURALLY HUGE (does anyone know the manga "Berzerk" ? ^_^).

The Technique is obviously CREO...but what about the FORM?
Any requisites?
And how much damage should it do?//

If you want bone to be harder than steel it is unnatural and therefore 1, needs muto and 2, will be resisted by parma.

You could make a bone soup sword like Mr. Turra suggestests that isn't stopped by parma, but you couldn't make it both huge enough to resemble a boney I-beam while still light enough to weild easily easily and sharper than steel without magic in it.

Chuck, all duration year spells are rituals, Hasimir will need to use duration moon.

I hold that you could create a sword constructed of bones with a creo ritual as well but it would require a ritual and it would also not posses the unnatural abilities that Hasimir wants without additional work.

An option you might consider depending upon the power of the character is adding penetration to the enchantments on the sword.

An item created by Creo Momentary Ritual is "non magical".
It may be unnatural, as an apple with wings, or a talking chameleon, or bone as hard as steel...but THAT is not "magically active":
- it does not generate warping
- it is not affected by Magic Resistance

It is just a "weird" item.

Following the REGO discussion I learned that more effects put in the same spell have to be added toghether.
I was wondering where the "Form or Tecnique requisite" ended, and the "new effect" began.

I'm not going to make it "usable" in creation, that will come in a second time.
Now I just need to make the item :P

Let's see:
I can CreoCorpus a gigantic-bone-sword...that would be a LVL 5 effect to create the equivalent of a whole human body.
Then I need to make this fragile piece of crap into something as hard as steel...I will need a MutoCorpus(Terram) LVL 25

Joining the two effects will get me a:
CreoCorpus(Muto & Terram) Ritual
BL: 30
R: T(+5)
D: M
T: I
Unnatural (bones of steel) +5
Total= 40
The weapon is complete, sharp as a normal sword can be...but it's bigger and made of unnaturally hard bones.

OR

I can CreoTerram a gigantic-sword that looks bone-like...that would be a LVL 5, plus 1 magnitude for increased size (I doubt that a "gigantic" sword can be made out of 30 cubic centimeters of steel), plus 1 magnitude because it's an elaborate product.

That's a:
CreoTerram Ritual
BL: 5
R: T(+5)
D: M
T: I
Elaborate Item +5
Size Increment +5
Total= 20
The weapon is complete, sharp as a normal sword can be...but it's bigger and shaped as bones.
_________________________________

The first version is more difficult, but can be affected by CORPUS. The second is easyer, but can be affected by TERRAM.

Either choice has it's pros and cons...

I'm still wondering about what the statistics of such an item (assuming one can wield it normally) would be :P

"An item created by Creo Momentary Ritual is "non magical".
It may be unnatural, as an apple with wings, or a talking chameleon, or bone as hard as steel...but THAT is not "magically active":
- it does not generate warping
- it is not affected by Magic Resistance"

Again I am without the book but I ask you to once again look at the definition of creo and the section on creo rituals. If I recall correctly, (and if I don't you have my appologies) in addition to saying things that are created with creo rituals are natural it also says that only natural things can be created. You also may find (if my recall is not faulty) a statement along the lines that a creo spell could make a sword as sharp as natural methods can get it but no sharper (but maybe this bit is in rego).

Clearly bone that is harder and sharper than steel will violate both of these prescriptions. (If they're really there)

//Chuck, all duration year spells are rituals, Hasimir will need to use duration moon.//

My bad. Sorry :(

p77 Creo:

Creo makes things that exist independantly into better things of their kind.

...A Magus can also use Creo to make something a better example of it's kind...

...Thus, Creo can make a horse as swift as the fastest horse or a man as strong as the strongest man. Creo cannot make a horse able to run as fast as the wind because no ordinary horse can do that, nor can it make a man strong enough to lift a castle....

This establishes that Creo is limited by essential nature in that the best Creo can do is produce 'the best example of'.

Thus Creo can produce the best apple ever, but it can not produce an apple with wings.

To create an apple with wings one must use Muto.

pg78
"By using Muto magic a magus can grant or remove properties something cannot naturally have. Thus, Muto can give a person wings...."

Chuck

P.S.
And for no particular reason I'd like to point out that I *think* Erik and I met briefly at a Gen Con about a million years ago. I used to live in Milwaukee and didn't miss GC until it moved away. Sniff, sniff. I don't know why I suddenly remembered this, but then again maybe the idea was Creo'd into my Mentem.

//And for no particular reason I'd like to point out that I *think* Erik and I met briefly at a Gen Con about a million years ago. I used to live in Milwaukee and didn't miss GC until it moved away. Sniff, sniff. I don't know why I suddenly remembered this, but then again maybe the idea was Creo'd into my Mentem.//

I thik so. Was it 2000? Dune and D&D 3 were the hits of the show. I was working for Fantasy Flight games trying to sell diskwars and the brand new Blue Planet. John K-somthing who was a co-author on Kaballah and WGRE was there as well.

Or am I the one suffering from creo mentem now?

Yeah, Dune came out! I'm not crazy (open to debate)! So now that we've established that, how's it going? LOL

Chuck

DUNE...what? where? how?...I wan't IT!
Whatever it is...if it's Dune related, I want it! :)
____________

Question:
Can a CREO ritual have a Muto (or other Tecnique/Form) casting requirement, so that it can create something "original"?

//DUNE...what? where? how?...I wan't IT!
Whatever it is...if it's Dune related, I want it! :)//

I feel like the offical supplier of bad news for you.

There was a Dune RPG developed by last unicorn games using the coda system that they developed for star trek (the base mechanic was a die pool high die + modifiers, from an RPG mechanics standpoint you might consider Dune to be a descendant of Deadlands and an ancestor of Silloette and Blue Planet v.2). Last Unicorn games never had the money to print the thing. LUG was purchased by WotC who printed a limited number of the game books all of which were sold at Gen Con (it's a fantastically beautiful book, you should see it). The Herbert estate did not renew the lisense to WotC who would have reworked the game as D20 anyway. (Why the lisence wasn't renewed was never made public , it's not really any of our business, but I can imagine many reasonable motivations for both parties to not continue).

The game revolves around playing a minor house similar to the way that covenants work in Ars Magica. Someone would play the mentat, someone else the benegesserit, another might play a swordsmaster or a noble etcetera.

I hope one of my friends who was at gen con with me that year will one day get off their duff and run a game (they'll have to include me, where else will they get another copy of the rules?) but it has yet to come to pass.

I hear that the books go for a fortune on Ebay but I've never been so hard up that I've considered selling mine. (Perhaps one day it will fund my retirement.)

//Question:
Can a CREO ritual have a Muto (or other Tecnique/Form) casting requirement, so that it can create something "original"?//

I don't think this is explicitly covered anywhere in the rules (I'd love someone to prove me wrong) but my take on it would be no.

Creo creates objects from pure forms (this IIRC has been de-emphasized in fifth ed. it may no longer be there at all) and I don't see composite forms being availible for creation.

I also like the game balance aspect, if you want something magical (like a flying apple) it has to really be magical. This closes several loopholes that characters would otherwise have no motivation not to exploit.

Thx for the ansewr to both questions ^_^
I think I'll settle for the CreoTerram version :P
__________________
I've seen the Unicorn version of the DUNE game...very nice indeed!
If you are interested there is a good free DUNE rpg named "Imperium III"
(3 because it's at its 3rd version ^^)
It's a french project, also translated to Italian (my language ;P )

The system is very light, but sufficently consistent, and the rest of the book is well done too...giving a decent introduction to the whide univers of Dune.

Yeah Dune was a beautiful book. In terms of Holy Grails, I'd say it's more rare and expensive than Ars1 (which I have thank you very much).

And to think I could have had one. I held it in my hands. For however brief the moment was, I did touch it! And I didn't spend the cash. $40 bucks in 2000! That's like $400 in 2005!

http://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/11/11518.phtml

this second link will not last long:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dune-Chronicles-of-the-Imperium-RPG-Corebook_W0QQitemZ8704265937QQcategoryZ2547QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Ah the Golden Path...

Chuck

See?
It's difficult and it may not be worth the effort...but it CAN be done within the rules ;)

I love pointlessness ^_^

I have an option which you might like.

CrTe Momentary Ritual
BL: 5
R: T(+5)
D: M
T: I
Size Increment +5
Total= 15

This would create a "Permanent" Perfect great great Sword. I would then create a CrIm spell that would give it your kick ass look that I would enchant onto the holder of the sword so that the spell is casted onto the sword every time you take it out.

I know that by the rules, the sword would then be resisted since it carries a magical effect but I find it is more balanced and interesting if the Mundane part of the sword, that is the effect that it would have without the spell, cannot be resisted by MR.

If you use that house rule, then you have your perfect sword that you were looking for at the cost of 3 vis and one formulaic/enchantment spell.

You could also have your sword holder reduce the size or your sword for transport...

Enchanting the holder is a very good idea ^_^

Anyway a normal great sword can be done even without the size increment...and the "cool look" is also incorporated in the "I'm doing a sword" modifier ;)

Using Terram I can do the sword this way:

CrTe Ritual
BL: 5
R: T(+5)
D: M
T: I
+1 Increased Size (+5)
Elaborate Shape (+5) -> [even a normal sword requires this]

A normal "Great Sword" weights about 3Kg... gives +2 Init, +5 Attack, +2 Defence, +9 damage and requires +1 Str to be used.
For a reference, look at THIS picture: http://www.thearma.org/images/S2000/New_Folder/MoreS2/warmup4.jpg

This ritual will instead create a "sword" so huge it will require a lot more than 3Kg of steel, and the combat statistics SHOULD be much different!
Look at those pictures:
- http://www.figures.com/databases/news/cooljt/7/6.jpg
- http://www.animegamersusa.com/istarimages/p/p-693904331945!TOYCO.jpg
- http://www.411images.com/images/games/screenshots2/swordofbeserk.jpg

Now...imagine I am somehow able to wield it with finesse and know how to effectively use it in combat...
What will be the weapon stats? ^_^

Initiative: ?
Attack: ?
Defence: ?
Damage: ?
Required Strength: ?
Load: ?
_

One of the things I was thinking of was, the sword can be looked to as a source of inspiration. However, maybe it's better to not recreate it in the game. Personally, if I tell someone about an item I have there is typically two reactions. One is, 'Ah! That's from!"

The second is, "That's a cool idea!"

Essentially original ideas often get that extra point simply for being creative.

Everyone seemed to like my Magic Telescope and I'm a fan of Bernard Cornwell's Sharpe who carries a telescope, so I had to have one. Making it look through rock was my tweak.

I loved Erik's Book Stand, I thought that was great.

These things are original rather than swiped. I'm not bashing swiped, swiped things sometimes hold you unrealistic expectations or parameters so I'm simply suggesting, take the core idea and run with it.

First, if it's a giant bone sword, why don't you pick a bone. A bone of what? A Dragon? A giant? How did you get it?

What about an Antler? What if it was the Antler of a Giant Stag, and it just fell off with the change of the season?

Maybe it's not a sword at all, but an Antler than you attach a handle to. This could be a really weird weapon. It wouldn't be very effective as a 'swinging' weapon, but it maybe cause multiple wounds from stabbing. it could also maybe disarm people. Maybe the Antlers have vis in them.

Hey here's an interesting question. If an animal part like Antlers have vis in them, do they need to be opened for enchantment? Hmmmm..

Anyway, consider giant Antlers as a weapon, or an animal horn. Of if you have to have a bone, rather than making one, pick an mythic animal to kill and kill it. Of course you first have to define what 'animal' means and what 'kill' does.

Chuck

meant to send this to Hasimir0
sorry will

Edited 10/10/2005 3:08 pm ET by Tuura

My idea, actually, was to "just" spontaneously MutoCorpus my arm into the "thing" I will use as a weapon.
Then my old passion for manufacture kicked in, and I thought about a weapon "independent" by me...something tangible, stable and uber-cool ^^

Still, my question stands...I can get the item I want in 714 ways...but what its statistics look like?
I liked to have something "huge" and "bladed"...so a gigantic sword was the closest thing from which to take a reference for possible statistics.

I wanted a monstruous weapon to fit a specific character concept...that's all...

I'm leaving innovation and originality for the other topiks ;)

I know the sword you're talking about... Historically speaking, it'd be called a Zanba-to (Horse Cutting Sword). Specifically, the sword in question would be a weapon of quality as well (it was made specifically for him, by a master).

Use the stats for a caber (essentially, a short telephone pole) from 4th edition. Strength +4 to use. A weapon that size only works with strength to use it.

Bone is lighter than iron/steel, but is far more brittle. Best invest in some Muto to make it stronger...

I would also argue that you would need to have Profession : Swordsmith skill to be able to make the thing. But that's my saga, not yours...

Steve

>> DUNE...what? where? how?...I wan't IT!

As a Dune fan myself, who cannot afford to spend 200 dollars on a book, a suggestion that was made to me was buy the Dune encyclopedea, and use the traveler system.

Well I bought the encyclopedea at least.

But how about an Ars Magica/Dune cross over, with different kinds of spice, each related to a magical art?

//But how about an Ars Magica/Dune cross over, with different kinds of spice, each related to a magical art?//

You could call it, I dunno.... Vis!

chuck

>> You could call it, I dunno.... Vis!

But Intelligo Vis could be harvested from a sand worm, on Dune, and be essential for space travel.